ALYX: RIGHT NOW ON KCCI 8 NEWS CLOSE UP, AFTER GUN VIOLENCE. WE TALK WITH AN IOWA STATE UNIVERSITY PROFESSOR AND AUTHOR ABOUT HOW TO BREAK THE POLITICAL GRIDLOCK IN THE GUN DEBATE. AND DEMOCRATIC FRONT RUNNER JOE BIDEN. WE TALK ONE-ON-ONE WITH THE FORMER VICE PRESIDENT ABOUT HIS REACTION TO THE RECENT MASS SHOOTINGS AND HIS CRITICISM OF PRESIDENT TRUMP. KCCI 8 NEWS CLOSE UP STARTS RIGHT NOW. ANNOUNCER: THIS IS IOWA’S NEWS LEADER. THIS IS KCCI 8 NEWS CLOSE UP. ALYX: GOOD MORNING AND WELCOME TO KCCI 8 NEWS CLOSE UP. THE DEBATE OVER GUNS IS ONCE AGAIN FRONT AND CENTER IN THE AFTERMATH OF LAST WEEKEND’S MASS SHOOTINGS IN TEXAS AND OHIO. IOWA STATE UNIVERSITY ENGLISH PROFESSOR CRAIG ROOD RESEARCHES THE COMMUNICATION USED IN THE GUN DEBATE AND THE POLITICAL IMPASSE IT CREATES. HE IS THE AUTHOR OF “AFTER GUN VIOLENCE: DELIBERATION AND MEMORY IN THE AGE OF POLITICAL GRIDLOCK.” JOINING ME NOW IS PROFESSOR CRAIG ROOD. CAN’T THANK YOU ENOUGH FOR JOINING US. TELL US ABOUT YOUR INSPIRATION FOR WRITING THIS BOOK. CRAIG: WERE ALL FAMILIAR WITH MASS GUN VIOLENCE HAPPENING. PEOPLE BEING OUTRAGED, ISSUING TALKING POINTS, TALKING PAST EACH OTHER AND NOTHING CHANGES UNTIL THE NEXT MASS SHOOTING HAPPENS. I WROTE THIS BOOK WITH THE HOPE THAT IF WE CAN IMPROVE OUR COMMUNICATION, MAYBE WE CAN BETTER ADDRESS THE PROBLEM AND RATHER THAN JUST TALK PAST ONE ANOTHER WORK TOGETHER TO REDUCE GUN VIOLENCE. ALYX: YOU DON’T TAKE A PARTICULAR POSITION OR STANCE. YOU ARE TAKING THAT BACK SEAT AND EXAMINING WHY WE ARE COMING TO THIS IMPASSE. CRAIG: I’M NOT AN EXPERT ON PUBLIC POLICY. RHETORIC FOCUSED ON PUBLIC PERSUASION. I’M INTERESTED IN THIS CASE AND MY PERSUASION IS SO DIFFICULT AND IMPOSSIBLE, AND HOPEFULLY HOW WE CAN IMPROVE OUR COMMUNICATIONS. ALYX: HE LOOKED INTO THE WAY ADVOCACY GROUPS, COMMUNITY LEADERS, EVERYDAY CITIZENS, HOW WE TALK ABOUT GUN VIOLENCE. WHAT DO YOU NOTICE IN THOSE TRENDS YOU ARE SEEING WITHIN THOSE VERY DIFFERENT GROUPS? CRAIG: I THINK TO SOME EXTENT THE DISCOURSE THAT COMES FROM POLITICIANS AND ADVOCACY GROUPS DISTORTS THE ISSUE. OFTEN TIMES THEY CAN SUPPORT BY THE DEBATE OVER GUNS. 85% OF AMERICANS, ACCORDING TO THE PEW RESEARCH CENTER SUGGEST 85% SUPPORT BACKGROUND CHECKS. THAT’S AN AREA FOR PEOPLE WHO IDENTIFY AS GUN RIGHTS ADVOCATES AND REFORM ADVOCATES ACTUALLY SHARE A LOT IN COMMON. ALYX: THERE IS MORE IN COMMON ON CERTAIN PARTS OF THIS DEBATE THAN PEOPLE REALIZE. CRAIG: RIGHT, BUT THAT’S NOT AN EFFECTIVE MESSAGE OF FOR A POLITICIAN OR AN ADVOCACY GROUP. YOU WANT TO GET PEOPLE TO YOUR SIDE TO GET THEM MOTIVATED. ALYX: YOU NAMED SOME EMOTIONS. THIS IS A VERY EMOTIONAL CONVERSATION. YOU TALK ABOUT THE ROLE OF PUBLIC MEMORY INFLUENCING THE DISCUSSION OVER GUNS. EXPLAIN WHAT YOU MEAN BY THAT AND HOW THAT RELEASE -- THE SECOND AMENDMENT, THE VICTIMS AND RACE RELATIONS. CRAIG: ONE OF MY STARTING PLACES IS THE IDEA THAT THE GUN DEBATE IS ABOUT FAR MORE THAN GUNS AND FAR MORE THAN FACTS. THE DEBATE WILL NOT BE RESOLVED BY POINTING TO A STUDY. WE BRING A LOT OF STUFF AS INDIVIDUALS TO THESE DEBATES. IN PART BASED ON A PERSONAL EXPERIENCE WITH GUNS, AND PART BASED ON A BELIEF SYSTEM ABOUT WHAT IS RESPONSIBLE FOR GUN VIOLENCE, THE ROLE OF GOVERNMENT AND POTENTIALLY -- IN POTENTIALLY ADDRESSING THE PROBLEM. WE BRING ALL THIS STUFF TO THE DEBATES. THAT I TURN CAN SHAPE HOW WE INTERACT WITH ONE ANOTHER. IT CAN LEAD US TO TALK PAST ONE TO ANOTHER. ALYX: WE ALL HA DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVES AND WE ARE ALWAYS TRYING TO POINT THE FINGERS THIS IS THE RHETORIC YOU HEAR. IT’S A MENTAL HEAL ISSUE, WE DON’T HAVE ENOUGH BACKGROUND CHECKS, IT USED BE THE CONVERSATION OF BLAMING VIDEOGAMES FOR GUN VIOLENCE. WE ALL WANT TO POINT OUR FINGER TOWARD SOMETHING AND IT’S IN OU PAST EXPERIENCES THAT WANT US TO COME TO ONE SOLUTION, ONE ANSWER ARE YOU SEEING THAT DEBATE SHAPING THE WAY IT HAS THE PAST SEVERAL YEARS DO YOU SEE ANYTHING DIFFERENT WITH THE CURRENT DEBATE? WE JUST HAD TO MASS SHOOTINGS AND WE ARE STILL REELING FROM THOSE. CRAI YEAH, I’ CAUTIOUSLY OPTIMISTIC. ONE OF THE INSTANCES THAT STANDS OUT TO M IS THE COLUMBINE SHOOTING UNFOLDING 20 YEARS AGO. PRESIDENT CLIFTON WAS SPEAKING FROM THE WHITE HOUSE AND HE SAID PERHAPS NOW AMERICA WOULD WAKE UP TO THE DIMENSIONS OF THIS CHALLENGE. IT’S BEEN 20 YEARS. ALYX: THAT WAS A LONG TIME AGO. CRAIG: WE HAVE BEEN AT MOMENTS LIKE THIS BEFORE AND NOTHING SEEMS TO HAVE CHANGED. IT SEEMS LIKE THERE IS A BUILDING SENSE OF OUTRAGE AND FRUSTRATION THAT VIOLENCE HAPPENS AND NOTHING CHANGES. I’M OPTIMISTIC MAYBE WE CAN ENACT SOME SORT OF CHANGE. ALYX: WOULD YOU SAY WE FEEL WE ARE CLOSER TO THAT? THERE IS SO MUCH CALLING FOR FINDING COMMON GROUND. IS THERE ANY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN NO AND WHAT YOU JUST REFERENCED 20 YEARS AGO? CRAI THERE SEEMS TO BE A LARGER ADVOCACY MOVEMENT. I’M THINKING OF THE PARKLAND SHOOTING AND WHAT FOLLOWED THAT. I WOULD SAY THE PROBLEM IS NOT GOING TO GO AWAY ON ITS OWN. WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING I ORDER TO MAKE SURE THIS DOES NOT KEEP HAPPENING. YOU BRING UP PARKLAND AND KI INVOLVED WE ARE HITTING EVERY ECONOMIC STATUS. WE ARE GOING TO TAKE A BREAK NOW BUT WE WILL BE RIG BACK WITH PROFESSOR ROOD AND HOW WE CA MOVE FORWARD BEYOND THE GRIDLOCK. A surprise medical bill can be traumatic, especially after a trip to the ER. But now the big insurance companies want to make things even harder on us, with a scheme called "Government Rate Setting." Doctor shortages, hospital closures. Rate Setting would only serve insurance companies, who are already making record profits, and hurt those who really matter. Patients. Us. Tell Senator Ernst to choose patients and vote NO on Rate Setting. Paid for by Doctor Patient Unity. ALYX: WELCOME BACK. WE CONTINUED WITH OUR CONVERSATION ABOUT THE GUN DEBATE WITH CRAIG ROOD. HE IS AN ASSISTANT PROFESSOR OF ENGLISH AT IOWA STATE UNIVERSITY. AND NOW THE AUTHOR OF THE BOOK " “AFTER GUN VIOLENCE: DELIBERATION AND MEMORY IN AN AGE OF POLITICAL GRIDLOCK.” HOW DO WE BEGIN TO BREAK DOWN THIS GRIDLOCK? CRAIG: I THINK THERE ARE SOME GOOD REASONS AND BAD REASONS WHY IT EXISTS. SOME OF THE GOOD REASONS ARE THAT THE STAKES OF THIS ISSUE SEEM INCREDIBLY HIGH. LIVES ARE AT STAKE. THE MEANING OF AMERICA IS OFTEN AT STAKE IN THESE DEBATE. THE POTENTIAL IS COMPLEX. MASS SHOOTINGS GAIN ATTENTION BUT MASS SHOOTINGS ARE NOT THE ONLY FORM OF GUN VIOLENCE. SUICIDES ARE AN IMPORTANT PROBLEM. DOMESTIC VIOLENCE IS A PROBLEM. GANG VIOLENCE IS A PROBLEM. IT IS POSSIBLE ALL THOSE PROBLEMS HAVE THE SAME ROOT CAUSE BUT IT’S ALSO POSSIBLE THEY HAVE DIFFERENT CAUSES THERE ARE BENEFITS AND TRADE-OFFS TO HIS POTENTIAL. THAT MAKES IT EVEN MORE COMPLICATED. I MENTIONED THE DEBATE ABOUT GUNS IS ABOUT FAR MORE THAN GUNS. IT IS NOT JUST ABOUT FACTS OR POINTING TO THE RIGHT STUDY BUT DIFFERENT SENSES OF WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR GUN VIOLENCE, WHAT ROLE THE GOVERNMENT SHOULD PLAY AND IT’S ALSO A QUESTION OVER IDENTITY AND WHO WE IMAGINE OURSELVES AND OUR OPPONENTS TO BE. IT’S ALSO THE CASE THERE ARE BAD REASONS FOR THE GRIDLOCK. IN PART YOU CAN PLACE THE BLAME ON POLITICIANS AND ADVOCACY GROUPS WHO GIVE US A LOT OF FALSE CHOICES. BEGUN GUN IS THE BLAME FOR THE SHOOTER IS TO BLAME. YOU’RE EITHER FOR GUN CONTROL OR FOR GUN RIGHTS. IN ACTUALITY IS POSSIBLE THAT BOTH OF THOSE THINGS ARE RESPONSIBLE AND BOTH CAN HAPPEN. ALYX: DO YOU LAYOUT STRATEGIES? HOW WE CAN WORK TOWARDS AN UNDERSTANDING? CRAIG: PART OF IT IS BEYOND INDIVIDUALS. IT’S A CRITIQUE OF THE MEDIA TO SOME EXTENT. I THINK WE NEED TO DO ALL WE CAN TO NOT GLAMORIZE SHOOTERS BY GIVING THE NAME, SHOWING THEIR IMAGES, INDICATING HOW MANY PEOPLE WERE KILLED AS IF IT WERE A RECORD FOR THE NEXT MASS SHOOTER. THOSE ARE NEWSWORTHY ITEMS BUT WE ALSO NEED TO BE CONSCIOUS OF POTENTIAL RAMIFICATIONS OF THAT SORT OF DISCOURSE. I THINK IT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO THE BEYOND THE QUESTION OF WHY, WHICH IS A VALUABLE QUESTION AND IT MAKES SENSE WHY WE ASK IT, BUT IT OFTEN LEADS US TO FOCUS ON A PARTICULAR MASS SHOOTER. WHAT WAS HE DOING A FEW DAYS BEFORE THE SHOOTING? WHAT WAS HE LIKE IN HIGH SCHOOL? THOSE QUESTIONS ARE VALUABLE BUT NOT ENOUGH TO MOVE BEYOND THAT AND ASK WHAT MAKES VIOLENCE LIKE THIS POSSIBLE. ALYX: IT’S WORTH REPEATING THAT YOU DO NOT PICK A SIDE. YOU ARE ANALYZING BOTH PHYSICIANS AND HOW WE CAN GET PAST AND CREATE A BETTER, MORE HEALTHY CONVERSATION AND COME TO SOMETHING THE MAJORITY OF AMERICANS FEEL COMFORTABLE WITH, AND SAFE. THIS IS ALL ABOUT SAFETY. CRAIG: THAT IS SOMETHING GUN RIGHTS ADVOCATES AND THOSE THAT ADVOCATE FOR FOR -- REFORM SHARE IN COMMON. THEY DO HAVE THAT COMMON GROUND. ALYX: YOU THINK IT TAKES HIGHLIGHTING WHAT WE DO AGREE ON FIRST AND THEN WORKING OUT THE DETAILS OF WHAT SEPARATES US AS INDIVIDUALS AND AS A COUNTRY? CRAIG: YEAH. ALYX: I’M WONDERING IF SOME OF THE STRATEGIES YOU POINT OUT IN YOUR BOOK, IF YOU’RE ABLE TO IDENTIFY WITH THE GUN DEBATE, IF SOME OF THE STRATEGIES COULD BE APPLIED TO OTHER DIVISIVE ISSUES LIKE CLIMATE CHANGE, IMMIGRATION. CRAIG: IF YOU ASK ADVOCATES ON EITHER SIDE THEIR ANSWER IS WE NEED TO PRESSURE REPRESENTATIVES. EVEN IF YOU AGREE ON A LOT OF THINGS, TRYING TO GET THEM TO SEE I DO I DO WITH YOU ON THE ISSUE OF GUN VIOLENCE. MY PERSPECTIVE AS A COMMUNICATIONS SCHOLAR IS NOT TO AGREE OR DISAGREE WITH THE POSITION BUT TO SAY WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO DISAGREE WITH ONE ANOTHER IN THIS COUNTRY WITHOUT WISHING TO DESTROY ONE ANOTHER. ALYX: IT IS NOT ME VERSUS YOU. JUST BECAUSE I FEEL I AM RIGHT DOES NOT MAKE YOU WRONG, KIND OF? THERE DOESN’T HAVE TO BE A RIGHT OR WRONG ANSWER. WE BOTH CAN BE RIGHT IN FINDING THE MIDDLE GROUND. CRAIG: THERE MIGHT BE A RIGHT ANSWER BUT I THINK PART OF OUR DIFFICULTY WITH TALKING ABOUT THIS ISSUE IS THERE IS SUCH MISTRUST. IT IS NOT JUST THAT MY OPPONENT IS WRONG OR UN-AMERICAN OR EVIL. THERE MIGHT BE CASES IN WHICH THAT IS TRUE BUT THE MAJORITY OF AMERICANS, THAT’S NOT TRUE. WHETHER YOU’RE A DEMOCRAT OR REPUBLICAN, IN FAVOR OF GUN CONTROL ARE NOT, YOU’RE CONCERNED ABOUT THE SAFETY OF YOUR KIDS, BEING ABLE TO GO INTO PUBLIC SPACES AND BE SAFE. AS YOU MENTIONED, START WITH THE COMMON GROUND AND THEN MAYBE WE CAN ISOLATE DISAGREEMENT AND RESOLVE THOSE. ALYX: WITH A GUN DEBATE YOU MENTIONED YOUR OPTIMISTIC. WHAT DO YOU SEE AS BEING THE NEXT STEP TO COMING TO A CONCLUSION? ACTUALLY HELPING US MOVE FORWARD WITH THE GUN DEBATE? DO YOU SEE WHAT THE NEXT STEP COULD BE? CRAIG: AS A SCHOLAR I HAVE THE LUXURY OF TAKING THE LONG VIEW. ALYX: TAKE IT. CRAIG: I THINK THERE IS SOMETIMES HOPE THAT PASSING A PIECE OF LEGISLATION THAT GUN VIOLENCE WILL GO AWAY. I GOT TICKETS THAT SIMPLE. THAT IS THE SHORT GAME. EVEN IF LEGISLATION WERE PASSED, THERE IS STILL DIVISIONS IN AMERICA ABOUT THE ROLE OF GUNS IN AMERICAN SOCIETY. THERE WILL BE PROBABLY A BACKLASH AND A CONTINUED FIGHT. DISAGREEMENT IS NOT BAD. THAT’S FINE. WE NEED TO MAKE SURE WE ARE DISAGREEING WITH ONE ANOTHER IN A WAY THAT IS BASED ON UNDERSTANDING AND ACCURACY RATHER THAN DEMONIZATION AND DISTORTION. ALYX: DO YOU THINK IT JUST TAKES A FEW KEY PLAYERS TO GET THAT GOING? GETTING A LITTLE BIT OF THE SHORT GAME SO WE CAN GET THE LONG-TERM? WHAT WILL IT TAKE TO GET THE BALL ROLLING TO KEEP WITH THE SPORTS REFERENCES? CRAIG: IF THE SHORT GAME IS A PARTICULAR PIECE OF LEGISLATION, MAYBE SOME KEY PLAYERS WOULD HELP INITIATE THAT. MAYBE I’M NAIVE. I’M LOOKING MORE BROADLY AT THE CONTEXT OF AMERICAN CULTURE. WE ARE SEPARATED INTO DIFFERENT CAMPS. WE OFTEN DON’T UNDERSTAND THOSE PEOPLE WHO DEGREES WITH US BUT WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT. GUN VIOLENCE IS ONE PROBLEM AMONG MANY PROBLEMS. WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO AGREE IT IS A PROBLEM AND FIND WAYS TO TALK ABOUT IT. ALYX: NOT AN EASY TOPIC AND AN EMOTIONAL ONE. THANK YOU FOR HELPING US TALK ABOUT IT THIS MORNING. THANK YOU FOR JOINING US. COMING UP, OUR CHIEF POLITICAL REPORTER CYNTHIA FODOR TALKS ONE-ON-ONE WITH DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL FRONT RUNNER FORMER VICE PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN. STAY WITH US. ALYX: WELCOME BACK TO KCCI 8 NEWS CLOSE UP. DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE AND FORMER VICE PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN VISITED THE IOWA STATE FAIR LAST WEEK. WHILE HE WAS IN DES MOINES HE SAT DOWN WITH KCCI’S CYNTHIA FODOR AND TALKED ABOUT HIS REACTION TO THE RECENT MASS SHOOTINGS IN TEXAS AND OHIO. VICE PRES. BIDEN: IT HAS --CYNTHIA: THE FOCUS FOR EVERYONE RIGHT NOW IS ON HOW TO STOP THIS GUN VIOLENCE. WHAT KIND OF ACTION DO YOU THINK WE NEED TO TAKE REALISTICALLY? SOMETHING WE CAN GET DONE? VICE PRES. BIDEN: I THINK IT’S A LOT MORE THAN GUNS. IT’S ABOUT THE EMBRACE OF HATE. THE LANGUAGE BEING USED IS ENCOURAGING PEOPLE TO ACT IN WAYS THAT IS CONTRARY -- IT IS NOT UNTIL ILLNESS. IT IS HATE. IT IS WHITE SUPREMACY, A LOT OF WHAT HAPPENED THIS WEEK. IN REGARD TO GUNS I WAS ABLE TO BE IN THE PAST BAN ASSAULT WEAPONS FOR 10 YEARS IN THE CRIME BILL AND LIMIT THE NUMBERS OF BULLETS THAT COULD BE IN THE CLIP OF THE GUN. I THINK WE CAN DO THAT AGAIN. WHAT HAPPENED LAST TIME WAS IN THE CONTEXT OF A MUCH LARGER PIECE OF LEGISLATION THAT PEOPLE REALLY NEEDED TO HAVE. THE VIOLENCE AGAINST WOMEN ACT AND OTHER THINGS. IT IS NOT JUST ONE THING. I THINK WHAT HAS HAPPENED IS I THINK EVEN THE MAJORITY OF NRA MEMBERS KNOW THAT THESE ASSAULT WEAPONS HAVE NO SOCIAL REDEEMING VALUE. YOU DON’T NEED ANYTHING WITH 100 BULLETS IN IT. YOU DON’T NEED ANYTHING WITH 30 ROUNDS AND IT. CYNTHIA: SHOULD THEY BE IN THEM? VICE PRES. BIDEN: ABSOLUTELY. I’M THE ONLY PERSON THAT BEAT THE NRA TWICE, BOTH ON LIMITING THE NUMBER OF BULLETS IN THE CLIP AS WELL AS ELIMINATING ASSAULT WEAPONS. NRA MEMBERS, THE MAJORITY KNOW THAT MAKES NO SENSE NOT TO HAVE THESE ON THE STREETS. THEY ARE MILITARY STYLE WEAPONS. THERE IS NO VIOLATION OF THE SECOND AMENDMENT TO DO THIS. THERE HAS ALWAYS BEEN -- EVERY COMMITMENT HAS A LIMITATION. WHO CAN ON A WEAPON IN THE FIRST PLACE? THAT IS WHY WE SHOULD HAVE UNIVERSAL BACKGROUND CHECKS. I WAS ABLE TO GET THE BRADY BILL PASSED IN THE 1990’S. WE SHOULD HAVE BACKGROUND CHECKS AND LEMONADE ASSAULT WEAPONS OF THE KIND USED IN EL PASO, AS WELL AS LIMITING THE NUMBER OF BULLETS THAT CAN BE IN THE CLIP OF A GUN. CYNTHIA: DO YOU THINK PRESIDENT TRUMP SHOULD SIGN AN EXECUTIVE ORDER ON BACKGROUND CHECKS? VICE PRES. BIDEN: HE SHOULD. NOW HE’S BEEN THREATENED BY THE NRA. MR. PRESIDENT, STEP UP. YOU SAID BEFORE YOU WERE WORRIED SOME REPUBLICAN FRIENDS WERE AFRAID OF THE NRA. PROVE YOU FRIENDS WITH THE NRA. I WANT TO WORK WITH YOU. DO THE BACKGROUND CHECKS. WE NEED MORE TO DO BUT I WILL BE HAPPY JUST DOING THAT RIGHT NOW. CYNTHIA: YOU SAID TODAY, IN FACT, THAT HIS RESPONSE TO THIS HAS FANNED THE FLAMES OF WHITE SUPREMACY. ELIZABETH WARREN TODAY IS CALLING HIM A WHITE SUPREMACIST. DO YOU THINK DONALD TRUMP IS A WHITE SUPREMACIST? VICE PRES. BIDEN: HE HAS DONE EVERYTHING TO EMBRACE WHITE SUPREMACY AND GIVEN REASON TO THINK THEY ARE ACCEPTABLE. HE REFUSED TO CONDEMN THEM. WHETHER HE IS A WHITE SUPREMACIST OR NOT, HE HAS ENCOURAGED WHITE SUPREMACY. I FIND NO DISTINCTION BETWEEN ENCOURAGEMENT AND WHETHER HE IS ONE. WHAT HE IS DOING IS WRONG. IT IS WRONG. CYNTHIA: SOME HAVE CALLED FOR MITCH MCCONNELL TO CALL BACK THE SENATE RIGHT NOW TO TAKE ACTION. VICE PRES. BIDEN: I WOULD TOO BUT I DON’T SEE ANY COURAGE ON MITCH’S PART TO DO THAT. THAT’S WHAT WE HAVE TO GO OUT THIS NEXT TIME AROUND AND -- THERE ARE SOME REPUBLICANS THAT WILL COME AROUND. SOME RATIONAL REPUBLICANS ARE OUT THERE WHO ARE NOT AFRAID OF THE NRA. I’M NOT BEING A WISE GUY WHEN I SAY THAT. I DON’T ANTICIPATE MITCH WILL BE THE ONE TO DO THE RIGHT THING ON THIS. ALYX: CYNTHIA’S CONVERSATION WITH FORMER VICE PRESIDENT BIDEN CONTINUES AFTER THIS BREAK. Donald Trump failed as a businessman. and He borrowed billionsing. and left a trail of bankruptcy and broken promises. He hasn't changed. I started a tiny investment business, and over 27 years, grew it successfully to 36 billion dollars. I'm Tom Steyer and I approve this message. I'm running for president because unlike other candidates, I can go head to head with Donald Trump on the economy, a fraud and a failure. ALYX: WELCOME BACK TO KCCI 8 NEWS CLOSE UP. WE CONTINUE NOW WITH THE FINAL PART OF CYNTHIA’S CONVERSATION WITH DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE AND FORMER VICE PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN. CYNTHIA: YOU HAVE GONE THROUGH A DIFFICULT TIME OF LOSS, NOT JUST ONCE BUT TWICE IN YOUR LIFE. YOU HAVE INSPIRED OTHERS WITH YOUR MESSAGE ON HOW TO OVERCOME GRIEF. WHAT WORDS OF WISDOM DO YOU HAVE FOR THE COUNTRY RIGHT NOW FOR THIS DIFFICULT TIME? VICE PRES. BIDEN: UNDERSTAND THAT THESE PEOPLE ARE VICTIMS, LOST FAMILY MEMBERS, CHILDREN, HUSBANDS, WIVES. THEY LOST PART OF THEIR SOUL. IT IS SO PROFOUND AN IMPACT. I SAY TO THE PEOPLE WHO HAD THAT LOSS YOU WILL NOT IN FACT FIND ANY SOLACE FOR A LONG TIME. YOU HAVE GOT TO FIND PURPOSE. YOU HAVE TO FIND PURPOSE. THESE FOLKS, THE PEOPLE YOU LOST WILL ALWAYS BE WITH YOU. ALWAYS WITH YOU. THERE WILL COME A TIME, AND IT WILL TAKE A LONG TIME WHEN THEIR MEMORY BRINGS A SMILE BEFORE IT BRINGS A TEAR TO YOUR EYE AND THAT IS WHEN YOU KNOW YOU’LL MAKE IT. PEOPLE WANT TO KNOW, AM I GOING TO BE ABLE TO GET THROUGH THIS? LITERALLY, AND MIGHT GOING TO BE ABLE TO MAKE IT? I HAD A FRIEND THAT SHE BECAME A FRIEND WHEN I LOST MY WIFE AND DAUGHTER. PEOPLE COME UP AND SAY I KNOW HOW IT FEELS. THEY MEAN WELL BUT THEY HAVE NO IDEA HOW IT FEELS. AT ONE POINT YOU FEEL LIKE SAYING STOP. YOU UNDERSTAND THEY ARE TRYING TO BE NICE. THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN THROUGH IT KNOW. I GOT A CALL FROM THE FORMER GOVERNOR OF NEW JERSEY. I GOT A CALL AND HE SAID I WILL GIVE YOU A PIECE OF ADVICE. I KEPT A CALENDAR, TAKE GRAPH. I PUT HOW I FELT ON ONE TO TEN. HE SAID I PUT THE MONTHS AND DAYS. I CHARTED EVERY DAY BEFORE I WENT TO BED. WAS IT A ONE, A SIX, A TWO? ON THE DOWN DAYS COME, THEY ARE JUST AS FAR DOWN AS THE DAY YOU HEARD THE NEWS. HE SAID THAT WILL HAPPEN, BUT THEY WILL GET FURTHER AND FURTHER APART. THAT IS WHEN YOU KNOW YOU WILL BE OK. THAT IS WHEN YOU KNOW YOU CAN MAKE IT. EMBRACE THE PEOPLE WHO WERE LEFT. EMBRACE YOUR OTHER CHILDREN. WHOEVER THE SURVIVORS ARE, EMBRACE THEM. CYNTHIA: WE DON’T WANT TO BE A COUNTRY LIVING IN FEAR RIGHT NOW. VICE PRES. BIDEN: LOOK, THAT IS WHY I CAN’T -- IT IS SO, SO SAD. PAULINE DUNN SHOWS THAT THE GREATEST FEAR FOR THIS Z GENERATION. IT’S GUN VIOLENCE. GETTING SHOT IN SCHOOL. THINK ABOUT THAT. ON A SCALE OF ONE TO SIX, WHAT’S THE MOST URGENT C CONCERN? 15 TO 30, PEOPLE GETTING SHOT IN SCHOOL. THIS IS THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. WHAT IN GOD’S NAME ARE WE DOING? WHAT ARE WE DOING? THERE IS NO RATIONALE TO HAVE 100 ROUNDS IN A CLIP. NO RATIONALE FOR AK-47S OR AR-15S. NONE. ALYX: THANK YOU FOR JOINING US FOR KCCI 8 NEWS CLOSE UP. WE W